Neama Rahmani protected corporations, prosecuted cartels and now he fights for the little guy

1
00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:40,050
Hey.
Everybody and see your killer

2
00:00:40,050 --> 00:00:42,290
country.
My name is Brittany Ransom and

3
00:00:42,290 --> 00:00:45,170
this is When Killers Get Caught,
a podcast devoted to deep dives

4
00:00:45,170 --> 00:00:46,610
into the killers we love to
learn about.

5
00:00:46,970 --> 00:00:49,450
But in season three we've been
taken one-on-one with people who

6
00:00:49,450 --> 00:00:52,210
are closely linked to crime
where have been affected by

7
00:00:52,210 --> 00:00:53,890
their connection to the justice
system.

8
00:00:54,090 --> 00:00:56,130
And today we have the
opportunity to talk to someone

9
00:00:56,130 --> 00:00:59,570
who is prosecuted over 1000
criminals as a former federal

10
00:00:59,570 --> 00:01:01,330
prosecutor who work with the
FBI.

11
00:01:01,810 --> 00:01:04,250
His name is Nema Romani.
He's currently the president and

12
00:01:04,250 --> 00:01:07,490
cofounder of West Coast Trial
Lawyers in Los Angeles, CA.

13
00:01:07,850 --> 00:01:10,650
And if you're a big fan of
watching news coverage or crime

14
00:01:10,650 --> 00:01:13,490
TV, there's a chance you've
probably seen him already

15
00:01:13,730 --> 00:01:16,570
commentating on the Johnny Depp
and Amber Heard trial, Britney

16
00:01:16,570 --> 00:01:20,690
Spears Conservatorship, Court
TV, pretty much every major news

17
00:01:20,690 --> 00:01:23,290
station.
And most recently, I recognized

18
00:01:23,410 --> 00:01:26,930
NEMA based on him talking about
one of his entertainment cases

19
00:01:26,930 --> 00:01:28,830
right now.
I'm really excited to have you

20
00:01:28,830 --> 00:01:31,310
here today and talk about your
life and your experiences over

21
00:01:31,310 --> 00:01:33,910
the last 20 years.
Welcome to the podcast Emma

22
00:01:35,590 --> 00:01:37,550
Brittany.
Thank you so much for having me.

23
00:01:37,550 --> 00:01:40,030
What a great introduction I'm
super excited to be on.

24
00:01:40,070 --> 00:01:43,110
So I have to ask you about this
because it's huge news in my

25
00:01:43,110 --> 00:01:45,510
circle.
I'm a plus size lady and so I've

26
00:01:45,510 --> 00:01:49,270
been all about the body
positivity and love over the

27
00:01:49,270 --> 00:01:53,070
many years and you are
representing.

28
00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:56,960
Several of Lizzo's former
dancers, and that's a huge deal.

29
00:01:56,960 --> 00:01:59,400
Among me and my friends.
I actually read a Deadline

30
00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:03,240
article about you like a week or
two ago where you said I've

31
00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:07,520
prosecuted drug cartels, so we
have no plan to back down.

32
00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:11,240
And then you said let's see if
Singer can actually try a case

33
00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:13,520
in the courtroom instead of the
media.

34
00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:19,670
I'm laughing because, you know,
I always try to keep a

35
00:02:19,670 --> 00:02:22,070
professional.
I like Marty.

36
00:02:22,070 --> 00:02:24,030
We've litigated cases in the
past.

37
00:02:24,630 --> 00:02:28,950
We have other cases together.
Right now he's representing one

38
00:02:29,110 --> 00:02:32,030
of Olivia Wilde or Jason
Sudeikis, maybe both.

39
00:02:32,070 --> 00:02:34,150
We're representing one of their
former employees with nanny.

40
00:02:34,150 --> 00:02:37,910
So, you know, often times it's a
small legal community.

41
00:02:37,910 --> 00:02:40,030
We go up against the same
people.

42
00:02:40,590 --> 00:02:45,780
But what I would say is Lizzo,
Lizzo, her spokespeople and her

43
00:02:45,780 --> 00:02:51,180
lawyer, they're taking a very
aggressive, frankly mean stance

44
00:02:51,420 --> 00:02:54,380
against our clients.
And we have four of them calling

45
00:02:54,380 --> 00:02:56,260
them all liars, saying none of
this happened.

46
00:02:56,260 --> 00:02:59,500
You know, when we filed this
case, I thought it'd go in one

47
00:02:59,500 --> 00:03:01,980
or two ways.
I thought that, you know, Liz

48
00:03:01,980 --> 00:03:05,020
would come out, maybe apologize
that she's made some mistakes.

49
00:03:05,020 --> 00:03:08,060
You know, we're not perfect.
You know, we'll do things better

50
00:03:08,060 --> 00:03:10,900
going forward.
But she's denying that any of

51
00:03:10,900 --> 00:03:13,790
this happened and calling our
clients liars.

52
00:03:13,950 --> 00:03:17,830
What do you think about that?
She put out.

53
00:03:18,750 --> 00:03:19,870
I was surprised.
Yeah.

54
00:03:19,870 --> 00:03:22,910
I thought it was very tone deaf.
Victim shaming, You know, you're

55
00:03:22,910 --> 00:03:26,790
talking about, you know, she's
all about positivity and

56
00:03:26,790 --> 00:03:30,350
advocating for a woman and plus
size woman and a woman of color.

57
00:03:30,350 --> 00:03:32,910
But these are our clients,
right?

58
00:03:32,910 --> 00:03:34,830
And she's calling them all
liars.

59
00:03:34,830 --> 00:03:39,590
So I was surprised.
I thought she would take a

60
00:03:39,590 --> 00:03:40,430
different approach.
Right.

61
00:03:40,430 --> 00:03:43,990
We've seen celebrities recently
when they messed up.

62
00:03:44,070 --> 00:03:48,190
Look at, you know, Ashton
Kutcher and Mira Kunis, right?

63
00:03:48,190 --> 00:03:50,350
They wrote letters of support
for Danny Masterson.

64
00:03:50,350 --> 00:03:54,390
They came out and apologized.
You know, we saw Drew Barry.

65
00:03:54,910 --> 00:03:57,710
Right across the ticket line,
you know, she apologized.

66
00:03:57,710 --> 00:03:59,750
You know, that's what I was
expecting.

67
00:03:59,750 --> 00:04:03,720
But you know, sometimes look
people, they double down in

68
00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:06,000
their lives and it's a
narcissism or whatever the case

69
00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:08,040
may be.
But it was a surprising

70
00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:09,080
reaction.
Well, now you've also got the

71
00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:12,640
scary word countersuit, because
that for that scares me.

72
00:04:12,640 --> 00:04:16,200
I mean, what do you say to your
clients when you hear from this

73
00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:19,519
huge name in media?
We're coming after you next.

74
00:04:20,079 --> 00:04:23,400
Well, look, they have to win
first and I have no, I have no,

75
00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:26,240
I have no problem trying this
case because you know, I believe

76
00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:28,040
our clients.
I believe their stories.

77
00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:31,480
I think, you know, jurors are
gonna like them and believe them

78
00:04:31,480 --> 00:04:33,520
as well.
And I think this is going to be

79
00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:36,200
exposed and more and more people
are coming forward.

80
00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:40,000
There's people who have said
they want to be witnesses.

81
00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:41,880
There's people that have claims,
but maybe they're outside the

82
00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:44,240
statute of limitations, but they
can talk about some of this

83
00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:46,560
conduct and there's gonna be
more clients as well.

84
00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:49,000
I mean, you're going to see,
Brittany, this isn't the end.

85
00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:52,560
Usually when people you know
mistreat others, it's not just

86
00:04:52,560 --> 00:04:55,680
one or two or three.
That tends to be who they are.

87
00:04:56,140 --> 00:04:58,860
And I think people are starting
to understand that the Lizo you

88
00:04:58,860 --> 00:05:03,580
see when the cameras are rolling
is not the Lizo the employer.

89
00:05:03,740 --> 00:05:07,140
That people that I actually had
to work with her, what they

90
00:05:07,140 --> 00:05:08,860
experienced was very different.
Well, you've got a lot of

91
00:05:08,860 --> 00:05:11,660
experience, I guess with like
dealing with celebrities now

92
00:05:11,860 --> 00:05:14,420
it's a it's a small frame for me
because I'm just a little

93
00:05:14,420 --> 00:05:16,860
influencer.
But I've come in contact with

94
00:05:16,860 --> 00:05:18,660
people and they're like, wow,
you're really nice.

95
00:05:18,660 --> 00:05:21,860
And I'm like most people aren't.
Apparently not.

96
00:05:21,860 --> 00:05:24,660
Apparently a lot of people are
really terrible in Hollywood,

97
00:05:24,660 --> 00:05:27,420
and I had no idea.
Do you experience.

98
00:05:27,420 --> 00:05:30,420
Yeah, that's unfortunate, you
know, And it's, yeah, it's

99
00:05:31,020 --> 00:05:35,260
unfortunately people in
positions of power, sometimes

100
00:05:35,260 --> 00:05:39,780
you misuse that power and
instead of, you know, bringing

101
00:05:39,780 --> 00:05:41,860
others up with them, they kick
them down.

102
00:05:41,860 --> 00:05:45,500
And I'm not saying it's just
limited to one particular case

103
00:05:45,500 --> 00:05:49,100
or client, but this is a problem
in Hollywood and you know, for

104
00:05:49,100 --> 00:05:51,810
many years it was rich, old,
white, right.

105
00:05:52,210 --> 00:05:56,490
But it's not limited to that.
You know, there are people who

106
00:05:56,970 --> 00:06:00,450
don't fall in that category and
they engage in misconduct

107
00:06:00,450 --> 00:06:03,650
because they think they can,
because they think that frankly,

108
00:06:04,210 --> 00:06:07,730
their employees should be happy
to be there, to be happy to

109
00:06:07,730 --> 00:06:08,370
have.
A job, right?

110
00:06:08,370 --> 00:06:11,810
What an amazing opportunity you
got to be on that TV show that

111
00:06:11,810 --> 00:06:13,810
won an Emmy.
Exactly.

112
00:06:13,810 --> 00:06:17,370
You know, you're on Lizzo's
reality TV show and you know,

113
00:06:17,370 --> 00:06:20,790
like I said, these are these are
dancers that probably wouldn't

114
00:06:20,790 --> 00:06:23,790
have had an opportunity
elsewhere in Hollywood.

115
00:06:23,790 --> 00:06:26,230
And that's something that
they've admitted Lizzo gave them

116
00:06:26,230 --> 00:06:28,390
their chance and that's why
they're so heartbroken to be

117
00:06:28,390 --> 00:06:29,910
treated the way they were.
Right.

118
00:06:29,950 --> 00:06:32,630
Well, one of the things you
mentioned to me in our private

119
00:06:32,630 --> 00:06:36,310
chat is that your firm only
accepts about 5 to 10% of the

120
00:06:36,310 --> 00:06:37,950
cases that come across your
desk.

121
00:06:38,310 --> 00:06:40,590
And you said you have about 25
lawyers there.

122
00:06:40,950 --> 00:06:43,710
So how do you decide?
Because I'm sure there's a lot

123
00:06:43,710 --> 00:06:46,950
of people knocking on your door.
Yeah, we get hundreds of calls

124
00:06:46,950 --> 00:06:51,270
every day and we can only accept
the small number because, well,

125
00:06:51,270 --> 00:06:53,550
for a few reasons, we only want
to take righteous cases.

126
00:06:53,710 --> 00:06:56,870
You know, we're we don't want to
take cases that we can't help

127
00:06:56,870 --> 00:06:59,390
people or or cases that we can't
win.

128
00:06:59,390 --> 00:07:01,110
I like to be honest with my
clients.

129
00:07:01,470 --> 00:07:03,790
And the other is there's
different types of firms.

130
00:07:03,790 --> 00:07:06,790
Some firms will sign a bunch of
clients, maybe send some demand

131
00:07:06,790 --> 00:07:10,230
letters and you know they might
drop the case if they don't get

132
00:07:10,230 --> 00:07:10,510
paid.
Wow.

133
00:07:11,270 --> 00:07:15,650
When we take a case, we
anticipate taking it all the way

134
00:07:15,650 --> 00:07:18,410
to trial.
That's how we think.

135
00:07:18,650 --> 00:07:22,490
So, you know, when I meet with
the client that says they've

136
00:07:22,490 --> 00:07:24,970
been mistreated by their
employer, I tell them honestly,

137
00:07:25,050 --> 00:07:27,050
we may have to try this case.
We're going to prepare the case

138
00:07:27,130 --> 00:07:29,770
to go to trial.
Now, not that many cases go to

139
00:07:29,770 --> 00:07:32,370
trial.
Oftentimes the defendants

140
00:07:32,370 --> 00:07:36,490
settle.
The clients may not want to tell

141
00:07:36,490 --> 00:07:39,250
their story, you know, in a very
public way at trial.

142
00:07:39,250 --> 00:07:43,130
But you know, the reason, you
know, I told Lizo's lawyers to

143
00:07:43,130 --> 00:07:46,690
bring it and let's try the case
is, you know, I have clients who

144
00:07:47,010 --> 00:07:49,810
have been very open about
telling their story, and they're

145
00:07:49,810 --> 00:07:53,370
happy to do so in a courtroom.
Not all clients feel the same

146
00:07:53,370 --> 00:07:56,690
way.
So now that Lizzo is saying that

147
00:07:56,690 --> 00:07:59,090
she wants to try the case, I'm
thinking, great, we're going to

148
00:07:59,090 --> 00:08:02,810
have a trial and the entire
world can decide who's telling

149
00:08:02,810 --> 00:08:03,410
the.
Truth, right?

150
00:08:03,530 --> 00:08:04,770
Because I could tell you,
Brittany.

151
00:08:04,770 --> 00:08:06,530
With a settlement, sorry, sorry,
when I was going.

152
00:08:06,570 --> 00:08:08,490
To say with a settlement,
doesn't that mean it can be

153
00:08:08,490 --> 00:08:11,290
closed?
Yeah, it's all confidential and

154
00:08:11,290 --> 00:08:15,090
usually there's a payment in
exchange for non disparagement

155
00:08:15,090 --> 00:08:17,810
or confidentiality.
That's oftentimes how these

156
00:08:17,850 --> 00:08:19,730
work.
So when you have the opportunity

157
00:08:19,810 --> 00:08:23,290
to go all the way to trial as a
lawyer, that's something that

158
00:08:23,290 --> 00:08:24,810
you look forward to.
That's why you went to law

159
00:08:24,810 --> 00:08:26,530
school.
So, you know, there might be

160
00:08:26,530 --> 00:08:27,810
some lawyers that want to
settle.

161
00:08:27,810 --> 00:08:31,900
They're afraid of trial.
But you know, Liz, they're

162
00:08:31,900 --> 00:08:34,340
talking to the wrong person.
I mean, I love trying cases.

163
00:08:34,340 --> 00:08:38,100
Look, I like trials so much.
I go on TV almost every day and

164
00:08:38,100 --> 00:08:39,620
I'm doing commentary and other
people.

165
00:08:40,220 --> 00:08:41,380
So don't you think I would like
to?

166
00:08:42,059 --> 00:08:43,980
I would like to try my own case.
Yeah.

167
00:08:44,260 --> 00:08:46,940
And my other thing is like,
since some of these people like

168
00:08:46,980 --> 00:08:52,460
Liz, a huge media personality, I
mean, what kind of Internet hate

169
00:08:52,500 --> 00:08:55,500
or even things mailed to your
office, things like that.

170
00:08:55,500 --> 00:08:59,170
Do you get that from your work?
Yeah, I do.

171
00:08:59,250 --> 00:09:01,170
Yeah.
I could tell you that most of

172
00:09:01,170 --> 00:09:04,450
the the folks who have been
covering the Lizzo case, I mean

173
00:09:04,450 --> 00:09:07,930
there's been some nasty things
said publicly, but most people

174
00:09:07,930 --> 00:09:10,690
haven't taken that personally,
fortunately.

175
00:09:10,810 --> 00:09:13,450
Like it's all business, right.
Everyone's entitled to someone

176
00:09:13,450 --> 00:09:17,130
to advocate on their behalf.
I would say the, the, the most

177
00:09:17,210 --> 00:09:20,970
hate I get is from covering the
Donald Trump case.

178
00:09:21,250 --> 00:09:24,930
I mean, it's just, and when I
say case because I mean, case

179
00:09:24,930 --> 00:09:27,930
says right, Is it.
Yeah, he's got 4 criminal cases

180
00:09:27,930 --> 00:09:29,610
in the middle of a civil trial
right now.

181
00:09:29,610 --> 00:09:34,130
So obviously, look, he's a big
story and I'm a legal

182
00:09:34,130 --> 00:09:36,170
commentator.
So I'm going to be talking about

183
00:09:36,170 --> 00:09:38,370
his cases and I'm going to say
it like it is.

184
00:09:38,370 --> 00:09:40,810
It's not political.
And I'm not saying he's going to

185
00:09:40,810 --> 00:09:42,970
win or lose the presidential
election.

186
00:09:43,570 --> 00:09:45,770
I stay in my lane, but I'm going
to be talking about the cases.

187
00:09:45,770 --> 00:09:48,930
And there's some people that
refused to believe that there's

188
00:09:48,930 --> 00:09:51,730
the possibility that the former
president committed a crime or

189
00:09:51,730 --> 00:09:54,530
committed multiple crimes.
So that's usually where I get

190
00:09:54,530 --> 00:09:58,890
most of my kind of hate mail.
It's related to the political

191
00:09:58,890 --> 00:10:01,850
cases that I cover.
Now, Speaking of the Lizo case,

192
00:10:01,850 --> 00:10:05,490
you said her people said they
want to go to trial, you want to

193
00:10:05,490 --> 00:10:08,130
go to trial.
So reasonably, when do you think

194
00:10:08,130 --> 00:10:10,450
we might actually get to see
this go to trial?

195
00:10:11,050 --> 00:10:14,230
Well, I think Lizo's team, they
might be talking about of both

196
00:10:14,230 --> 00:10:17,030
sides of their mouth.
And the reason is they didn't,

197
00:10:17,110 --> 00:10:18,630
you know, we demanded a jury
trial.

198
00:10:18,790 --> 00:10:22,070
They agreed to a jury trial, but
they filed an answer and they're

199
00:10:22,070 --> 00:10:25,510
trying to get this case moved
into a private arbitration.

200
00:10:25,790 --> 00:10:28,950
So, yeah, obviously we're going
to oppose that because we think

201
00:10:28,950 --> 00:10:31,630
that the public has a right to
know and I believe in our jury

202
00:10:31,630 --> 00:10:35,470
system, but they're going to try
to, you know, hide this away,

203
00:10:35,990 --> 00:10:40,160
have some secret private
arbitration handle this.

204
00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:42,680
So we'll see if we do get that
trial.

205
00:10:42,680 --> 00:10:44,560
I think that's going to be one
of the big issues in.

206
00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:47,760
The case, Well, we chatted about
what you're doing right now,

207
00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:50,760
talking about Trump, dealing
with Liz and a couple other

208
00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:52,400
cases.
But I do want to tell our

209
00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:54,280
listeners about kind of where
you came from.

210
00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:57,480
And one of the the big things in
your bio is you went to UCLA,

211
00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:01,040
you graduated from Harvard Law
at 22 years old, makes you one

212
00:11:01,040 --> 00:11:03,080
of the youngest graduates in 200
years.

213
00:11:03,360 --> 00:11:06,640
And then you got recruited into
this massive law firm.

214
00:11:07,640 --> 00:11:10,560
Can you kind of explain what
life was like for you at that

215
00:11:10,560 --> 00:11:13,080
moment?
So when I went to law school,

216
00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:14,800
it's kind of like the movie in
the firm.

217
00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:19,440
These big law firms show up and
they recruit you and they offer

218
00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:23,200
you a lot of money.
I mean, I was, you know, a law

219
00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:24,600
student.
I was 20 years old.

220
00:11:24,600 --> 00:11:26,920
I was making more money than I
could possibly dream of.

221
00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:30,640
So I ended up going after law
school in one of these firms

222
00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:32,280
that was a lawyer firm, massive
firm.

223
00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:34,440
At the time, it was the largest
law firm in Los Angeles.

224
00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:36,360
I don't know where things are
right now.

225
00:11:37,260 --> 00:11:41,780
And, you know, you end up
representing corporations that

226
00:11:41,820 --> 00:11:46,020
have a lot of money.
So my clients were Disney and

227
00:11:46,020 --> 00:11:49,180
Marriott and, you know, huge
company.

228
00:11:50,180 --> 00:11:53,100
But yeah, but you're defending
them.

229
00:11:53,100 --> 00:11:57,100
You're defending them oftentimes
against the little guy or a

230
00:11:57,100 --> 00:12:01,100
smaller company.
And, you know, ultimately we

231
00:12:01,100 --> 00:12:03,460
were hired by the Catholic
Church to represent them in the

232
00:12:03,460 --> 00:12:06,740
sex abuse cases.
And, you know, I hated it.

233
00:12:07,180 --> 00:12:08,580
That's not why I went to law
school.

234
00:12:08,940 --> 00:12:11,060
And that was sort of the
motivation for me to leave.

235
00:12:11,380 --> 00:12:14,020
I always wanted to be a
prosecutor and become a judge.

236
00:12:14,020 --> 00:12:19,180
That was always my career goal.
So, you know, I was looking to,

237
00:12:19,540 --> 00:12:22,300
you know, leave, join the
government, and the opportunity

238
00:12:22,300 --> 00:12:24,260
came up for me to join the
Department of Justice, the US

239
00:12:24,260 --> 00:12:27,460
Attorney's office.
But, you know, I didn't have the

240
00:12:27,820 --> 00:12:31,140
best experience working at what
we call big law, the huge

241
00:12:31,140 --> 00:12:35,850
corporations, just because I did
not like representing those

242
00:12:35,850 --> 00:12:39,570
types of clients.
I like helping people and, you

243
00:12:39,570 --> 00:12:41,930
know, pursuing justice.
And that's something I was able

244
00:12:41,930 --> 00:12:43,930
to do as a.
Prosecutor OK, that's definitely

245
00:12:43,930 --> 00:12:47,130
your next step, your federal
prosecutor in San Diego.

246
00:12:47,130 --> 00:12:49,490
There's got to be two way
different worlds.

247
00:12:50,290 --> 00:12:53,690
Oh, completely.
The way I describe it is when I

248
00:12:53,690 --> 00:12:57,730
was working at the big firm,
miserable every day except the

249
00:12:57,730 --> 00:13:01,610
twice a month I got paid.
When I was a prosecutor, I was

250
00:13:01,610 --> 00:13:04,160
happy every day.
Except that's why someone like,

251
00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:07,240
oh, no.
So took a huge, huge pay cut.

252
00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:09,960
Yeah.
To pursue justice.

253
00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:12,840
And it it was awesome.
You know, we were on the border.

254
00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:16,360
This was, you know what I
thought at the time, it's still,

255
00:13:16,440 --> 00:13:20,120
it's still continuing.
But this was the heyday of drug

256
00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:23,440
cartel violence, so we're
dealing with drug and human

257
00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:25,520
trafficking cases.
It was awesome.

258
00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:27,760
I loved it.
Amazing job.

259
00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:32,200
But then I had a couple kids and
then so I did.

260
00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:39,280
I stopped doing the DOJ work.
I went to the city of LA did you

261
00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:41,280
know, public corruption and
government ethics, campaign

262
00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:45,920
finance, election law work for a
while And ultimately started my

263
00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:49,240
own firm.
Because, you know, I sort of

264
00:13:49,240 --> 00:13:51,640
reached a crossroads where I
couldn't work for the government

265
00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:56,040
anymore just because I had two
young kids and childcare costs a

266
00:13:56,040 --> 00:13:57,880
lot.
My wife's a lawyer for foster

267
00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:02,230
kids, so 2 government lawyers
and two small kids living in LA

268
00:14:02,230 --> 00:14:04,350
which couldn't really make ends
meet financially.

269
00:14:04,910 --> 00:14:09,630
Now, with the work that you did
for, you know, as a federal

270
00:14:09,630 --> 00:14:14,670
prosecutor in San Diego, I spend
my, like most of my time

271
00:14:14,670 --> 00:14:17,550
researching the kind of cases
that you've prosecuted.

272
00:14:17,910 --> 00:14:19,710
And some of them are really
intense.

273
00:14:19,710 --> 00:14:22,990
There have been times that I
stepped away from my computer

274
00:14:22,990 --> 00:14:24,990
and was just like I need a
break.

275
00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:27,680
I don't want to see any more
crime scene photos.

276
00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:31,000
I don't want to read anything
else from these people.

277
00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:34,480
So I guess my, my my big
question is how to use stomach.

278
00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:38,280
The things that are heinous that
were part of that job.

279
00:14:38,280 --> 00:14:40,920
Like it was hard.
I mean, there were certain

280
00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:43,760
things that I absolutely hated
doing.

281
00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:48,840
I did not like child porn cases
and I didn't like sexual abuse

282
00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:51,740
of minors cases.
I just Crimes involving children

283
00:14:51,740 --> 00:14:55,340
are just really hard and handled
some of those cases I didn't

284
00:14:55,340 --> 00:14:55,780
like.
Those are the.

285
00:14:55,820 --> 00:14:57,220
Ones that affect me the most,
too.

286
00:14:57,820 --> 00:14:59,620
I mean, you're dealing with
child victims.

287
00:14:59,620 --> 00:15:02,580
I mean, what's worse than a kid
that's been the victim of a

288
00:15:02,580 --> 00:15:04,300
crime?
Yeah, you know, but when you're

289
00:15:04,300 --> 00:15:06,300
dealing with other types of
violence, like some people hate

290
00:15:06,300 --> 00:15:10,140
it, some people didn't like
amassing onto drugs or

291
00:15:10,140 --> 00:15:14,860
trafficked people or, you know,
the violence that accompanies

292
00:15:14,860 --> 00:15:16,400
all that.
But, you know, I liked it.

293
00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:19,040
It was interesting.
I was working with great agents,

294
00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:23,680
federal agents, right.
So look at FBI or Gea or customs

295
00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:26,280
or Border Patrol.
And, you know, we were, we were

296
00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:28,360
keeping the American people
safe.

297
00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:31,440
So certainly a lot better than
defending corporations.

298
00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:34,480
Absolutely loved it.
Greatest job in the world.

299
00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:37,880
If it wasn't for finances, I'd
probably still be doing that or

300
00:15:37,880 --> 00:15:40,080
be sitting on the bench as a
judge somewhere.

301
00:15:42,070 --> 00:15:45,470
Let's talk about, I guess, some
of your really big cases from

302
00:15:45,470 --> 00:15:47,830
that time period.
I mean, obviously the huge one

303
00:15:47,830 --> 00:15:51,710
is you helped take somebody off
of the America's Most Wanted

304
00:15:51,710 --> 00:15:54,630
list.
Yeah, so this was someone who

305
00:15:54,950 --> 00:16:00,150
was a murderer, drug kingpin
here in California.

306
00:16:00,510 --> 00:16:04,630
And you know, he was involved in
a drug related murder, fled to

307
00:16:04,630 --> 00:16:07,190
Mexico.
So we spent some time looking

308
00:16:07,190 --> 00:16:12,950
for him and through the help of,
you know, cooperators, it took a

309
00:16:12,950 --> 00:16:18,350
long time, years We were able to
identify where he was in Mexico,

310
00:16:18,790 --> 00:16:22,190
literally at a map we're able to
go in there and arrest him.

311
00:16:22,190 --> 00:16:25,390
So spent a lot of time working
on this case, was really proud

312
00:16:25,910 --> 00:16:30,630
of the work that we did, kind of
flipping folks and ultimately we

313
00:16:30,630 --> 00:16:35,710
were able to get one of the more
dangerous men in the United

314
00:16:35,710 --> 00:16:37,750
States and Mexico and put him
behind bars.

315
00:16:38,230 --> 00:16:40,480
I mean, that's a major.
Yeah.

316
00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:42,920
The other thing was, I noticed
that when you were the director

317
00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:46,680
of enforcement for the LA City
Ethics Commission, they said

318
00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:54,280
that you got some of the highest
fines in years in terms of, I

319
00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:56,840
guess, finding corruption.
Yeah.

320
00:16:56,840 --> 00:16:59,120
So, you know, I loved being a
prosecutor.

321
00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:04,040
You know, when when I put the
department justice work away, I

322
00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:06,680
ended up being the enforcement
director of the city of LA, the

323
00:17:06,680 --> 00:17:09,660
Ethics Commission.
So that's basically a watchdog

324
00:17:09,660 --> 00:17:13,900
that oversees the mayor, all the
elected officials, high level

325
00:17:13,900 --> 00:17:19,980
employees of the city of LA And
you know, I was able to oversee

326
00:17:19,980 --> 00:17:23,660
a couple big elections, Eric
Garcetti's election, I mean,

327
00:17:23,780 --> 00:17:27,740
this was, this was a while ago
and you know, we would

328
00:17:28,060 --> 00:17:30,980
investigate these candidates,
we'd investigate these elected

329
00:17:30,980 --> 00:17:34,220
officials and we'd go after
them.

330
00:17:34,220 --> 00:17:36,220
So it could be an administrative
action.

331
00:17:36,700 --> 00:17:39,580
It was criminal.
We work with the DA's office to

332
00:17:39,580 --> 00:17:42,460
prosecute them.
And really so turned out after I

333
00:17:42,460 --> 00:17:46,260
left that city of Lai mean,
anyone that lives in LA or is

334
00:17:46,260 --> 00:17:49,900
familiar with it, it has had
such a problem with corruption.

335
00:17:49,900 --> 00:17:52,780
You're talking about council
members, multiple under

336
00:17:52,780 --> 00:17:57,380
indictment, going to prison for
years, taking bribes.

337
00:17:57,380 --> 00:18:00,740
I mean, it's really bad and it
continues to get worse.

338
00:18:00,740 --> 00:18:04,860
So I did sort of learn and
understand, you know, that

339
00:18:05,790 --> 00:18:11,110
political side of things and how
much really, if you kind of look

340
00:18:11,110 --> 00:18:12,950
behind the curtain, how dirty it
really is.

341
00:18:13,830 --> 00:18:17,510
I remember a case gosh this was
had to have been like early 2

342
00:18:17,510 --> 00:18:22,150
the aughts so, but I remember
was specifically a police

343
00:18:22,150 --> 00:18:25,430
station.
There was a woman who was like

344
00:18:25,430 --> 00:18:29,670
the like a 911 operator and her
daughter was a prostitute, which

345
00:18:29,670 --> 00:18:32,350
I don't think she knew at the
time, but apparently.

346
00:18:32,860 --> 00:18:36,180
Almost all of the police
officers who worked in that

347
00:18:36,180 --> 00:18:39,540
district had seen her, and she
was a minor.

348
00:18:39,860 --> 00:18:43,620
And I just remember like a lot
of people lost their jobs and

349
00:18:43,620 --> 00:18:46,300
then they picked a new police
chief and then that one lost

350
00:18:46,300 --> 00:18:49,060
their job too.
Like, is that what we're talking

351
00:18:49,060 --> 00:18:51,140
about, those kinds of cases or
even worse?

352
00:18:51,580 --> 00:18:53,180
Yeah.
So when you're dealing with that

353
00:18:53,180 --> 00:18:58,540
type of corruption, we've gone
after a lot of, you know what we

354
00:18:58,540 --> 00:19:01,530
think I respect for law
enforcement, former prosecutor.

355
00:19:01,530 --> 00:19:05,370
But I mean, there's some law
enforcement types that should

356
00:19:05,650 --> 00:19:08,010
pay a lot of money or even be
behind bars, right?

357
00:19:08,010 --> 00:19:10,450
I mean, I believe no one is
above the law.

358
00:19:10,450 --> 00:19:14,290
I don't care if you're a police
officer, you're a president,

359
00:19:14,290 --> 00:19:16,330
you're a former president,
you're a president's son.

360
00:19:16,930 --> 00:19:18,970
I think the law should apply to
everyone.

361
00:19:19,810 --> 00:19:23,690
You know, when I was doing the
ethics work for the city of Lai,

362
00:19:23,690 --> 00:19:27,690
oversaw all the politicians,
there was a separate police

363
00:19:27,690 --> 00:19:32,340
Commission that oversaw Ltd.
So that was kind of stuff I was

364
00:19:32,340 --> 00:19:35,780
dealing with, you know, the
mayor, deputy mayor, city

365
00:19:35,780 --> 00:19:39,460
attorney, controller, all the
City Council members.

366
00:19:39,740 --> 00:19:42,420
So anyone that was kind of in
that world was under my

367
00:19:42,420 --> 00:19:44,860
supervision.
The police was a whole nother

368
00:19:44,860 --> 00:19:47,620
Commission with someone just
like me that was overseeing them

369
00:19:47,620 --> 00:19:49,700
on that stuff, definitely.
Needed somebody like you in my

370
00:19:49,700 --> 00:19:53,660
state because in our capital we
had an entire slew of

371
00:19:53,660 --> 00:19:58,180
politicians who were just using
money for random things.

372
00:19:58,620 --> 00:20:01,500
You know, got to love that.
Unfortunately, the tail as all

373
00:20:01,500 --> 00:20:04,540
this time, you know there's
power and it can be corrupting

374
00:20:04,580 --> 00:20:07,380
here and around the world, so I
don't know what the answer is.

375
00:20:07,540 --> 00:20:10,420
Why people in town of 50,000
need a private jet anywhere?

376
00:20:11,580 --> 00:20:13,660
You don't need that life.
Yeah, I don't understand that at

377
00:20:13,740 --> 00:20:15,220
all.
Yeah, no, definitely.

378
00:20:15,220 --> 00:20:18,100
Not but like you said, you take
a huge risk and you open your

379
00:20:18,100 --> 00:20:19,900
own firm.
You want to switch gears

380
00:20:19,900 --> 00:20:26,020
entirely to personal law.
Got to be scary, but you said

381
00:20:26,020 --> 00:20:28,660
that you needed to.
Kind of do better for your

382
00:20:28,660 --> 00:20:30,860
family.
What's that look like?

383
00:20:31,420 --> 00:20:35,540
Yeah.
So my wife and I, when basically

384
00:20:35,620 --> 00:20:39,220
we couldn't afford to both work
for the government, we sat down

385
00:20:39,220 --> 00:20:43,060
one day and she told me that one
of us needs to get a real job

386
00:20:43,060 --> 00:20:46,620
and that one of us is me.
So my real job, that means go

387
00:20:46,620 --> 00:20:48,060
back to the private sector and
make money.

388
00:20:48,100 --> 00:20:52,220
Actually, I'm gonna be honest.
I almost went back to the farm.

389
00:20:52,660 --> 00:20:54,180
They're talking about coming
back.

390
00:20:54,260 --> 00:20:58,460
And you know, there was a, there
was a lot of money involved.

391
00:20:58,620 --> 00:21:03,380
And you know, fortunately at the
time, my current partner's name

392
00:21:03,380 --> 00:21:04,980
is Allen.
He actually recruited me at a

393
00:21:04,980 --> 00:21:07,780
law school.
He was a young attorney at the

394
00:21:07,780 --> 00:21:10,340
time at the same firm, big law,
young attorney.

395
00:21:10,620 --> 00:21:13,500
He recruited me at a law school
and he left a few years after I

396
00:21:13,500 --> 00:21:14,940
joined.
And he started his own firm,

397
00:21:15,460 --> 00:21:17,060
small firm.
He teamed up with the public

398
00:21:17,060 --> 00:21:19,180
defender, buddy of his.
He was doing everything, family,

399
00:21:19,180 --> 00:21:21,900
law, immigration, criminal,
whatever came through the door,

400
00:21:22,620 --> 00:21:24,420
the more and more he started
doing plaintiffs work.

401
00:21:24,420 --> 00:21:26,980
So employment, personal entry,
representing people are saying

402
00:21:26,980 --> 00:21:29,540
bad it happened to them and
doing like contingency, which

403
00:21:29,540 --> 00:21:32,820
means wasn't charged an hourly
or retainer, just a percentage

404
00:21:32,820 --> 00:21:36,060
of what he recovered.
So it happened that at the time

405
00:21:36,340 --> 00:21:39,380
that I was looking to go back,
he approached me and he

406
00:21:39,380 --> 00:21:42,580
convinced me to start a new firm
with them.

407
00:21:42,580 --> 00:21:44,260
He's like, listen, don't go
back.

408
00:21:44,580 --> 00:21:46,540
You're not going to like
defending corporations.

409
00:21:46,540 --> 00:21:48,100
You're not like defending
criminals.

410
00:21:48,620 --> 00:21:51,660
We can represent the victims.
We could represent plaintiffs.

411
00:21:51,660 --> 00:21:54,160
And I said, I'm like, why would
I do that?

412
00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:56,840
I'm not going to be that guy on
some billboard or bus bench.

413
00:21:56,840 --> 00:21:58,920
That's just not me.
It's like, no, it's not going to

414
00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:00,400
be like that.
You're going to be helping

415
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:02,720
people.
It's like being a prosecutor but

416
00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:04,440
actually getting paid.
And that kind of goes back to

417
00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:07,120
that 510%.
We have the luxury now of

418
00:22:07,120 --> 00:22:09,480
choosing our clients, choosing
our cases.

419
00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:12,600
If I don't feel it's a righteous
case, I'm not going to take it

420
00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:16,460
With plenty of business.
You can, you know, refer them to

421
00:22:16,460 --> 00:22:20,060
other lawyers or refer them to
the local Bar Association.

422
00:22:20,060 --> 00:22:23,020
We'll help them out.
But unless I personally believe

423
00:22:23,020 --> 00:22:26,900
in the case, and if I think it's
a just case worth pursuing, I'm

424
00:22:26,900 --> 00:22:30,220
not going to take it.
OK, one of my things that I've

425
00:22:30,220 --> 00:22:37,220
been doing lately is I like your
LinkedIn posts and you, I kind

426
00:22:37,220 --> 00:22:39,780
of scroll through and I'm like,
look at all this stuff they're

427
00:22:39,780 --> 00:22:41,180
doing.
This is awesome.

428
00:22:42,210 --> 00:22:44,130
I saw that it said that, you
know, I'm a nerd.

429
00:22:44,130 --> 00:22:46,330
What can I say?
That's the best kind of people.

430
00:22:47,210 --> 00:22:52,090
I mean, gosh, there are so many.
Like you sued Charlie Sheen.

431
00:22:52,970 --> 00:22:55,130
That was another big one.
We we, we.

432
00:22:55,770 --> 00:22:58,130
That was, yeah.
He had Liz's lawyer.

433
00:22:58,130 --> 00:22:59,890
So.
No, No Way.

434
00:23:00,010 --> 00:23:03,370
And Marty Singer two, yeah, he
had singer, yeah.

435
00:23:03,370 --> 00:23:05,530
So Singer represented Sheen on
that one.

436
00:23:05,530 --> 00:23:08,770
So yeah, like I said, he's
someone that, you know, I've

437
00:23:08,770 --> 00:23:10,730
dealt with.
And again, sometimes it gets,

438
00:23:11,420 --> 00:23:13,900
you know, like I always try to
keep it professional, but on the

439
00:23:13,900 --> 00:23:17,500
other hand, I want to protect my
clients, you know, both in the

440
00:23:17,500 --> 00:23:22,140
courtroom and in the media.
So like, so hopefully we can we

441
00:23:22,140 --> 00:23:25,140
can keep things professional.
But yeah, I mean, I've dealt

442
00:23:25,140 --> 00:23:26,980
with Marty and his team before,
so.

443
00:23:27,140 --> 00:23:30,900
And then there was the case
where you represented female

444
00:23:30,900 --> 00:23:33,660
inmates who've been assaulted by
a sheriff's deputy while in

445
00:23:33,660 --> 00:23:36,700
police custody.
Yes, so we've done that.

446
00:23:36,700 --> 00:23:40,420
We've done a lot of sexual
assault cases.

447
00:23:40,940 --> 00:23:44,460
We've done a lot of police
misconduct cases, civil rights

448
00:23:44,460 --> 00:23:47,980
cases, death cases where
officers have killed someone.

449
00:23:47,980 --> 00:23:50,420
So I mean, what we've done a
lot.

450
00:23:50,540 --> 00:23:53,100
You know, I've sued the
Department of Justice, my former

451
00:23:53,100 --> 00:23:54,980
employer, for race
discrimination I need.

452
00:23:55,340 --> 00:23:59,020
To know about that one, yeah.
So I mean, we sued.

453
00:23:59,020 --> 00:24:02,460
It was.
It was someone that was

454
00:24:02,460 --> 00:24:06,380
retaliated against because, you
know, the allegations were, he's

455
00:24:06,380 --> 00:24:09,180
retaliated against because his
wife was Latina.

456
00:24:09,740 --> 00:24:13,220
And, you know, at the time there
were some allegations of racism

457
00:24:13,220 --> 00:24:15,940
at the US Attorney's office of
the Department of Justice.

458
00:24:15,940 --> 00:24:21,660
So he sided with the victims of
race discrimination.

459
00:24:22,180 --> 00:24:25,780
And his supervisors changed his
review, put a letter of

460
00:24:25,780 --> 00:24:28,420
reprimand in his file for no
reason.

461
00:24:29,100 --> 00:24:33,860
So when I said prostitute Carta,
I didn't sue the Department of

462
00:24:33,860 --> 00:24:35,540
Justice.
You know, we sued.

463
00:24:36,870 --> 00:24:40,430
You know, we file, we're
litigating, and then you know,

464
00:24:40,430 --> 00:24:41,670
we won the Department of
Justice.

465
00:24:41,830 --> 00:24:43,910
They took it all back.
They took a lot of reprimand,

466
00:24:43,910 --> 00:24:46,670
back changes, evaluation,
everything to what it was

467
00:24:46,670 --> 00:24:49,430
before, before the retaliation.
They paid for all our costs,

468
00:24:49,470 --> 00:24:50,870
everything.
So what?

469
00:24:50,950 --> 00:24:52,630
Happens for that guy though, at
that point.

470
00:24:53,030 --> 00:24:55,590
I mean, you don't feel
comfortable working there

471
00:24:55,590 --> 00:24:58,790
anymore, but you know what I
think now they know.

472
00:24:58,790 --> 00:25:02,510
Look, if they mess with him
again, just cuz he's a white

473
00:25:02,510 --> 00:25:05,530
guy, doesn't mean that.
But he's a lawyer himself, that

474
00:25:05,530 --> 00:25:08,170
he's not gonna lawyer up and
he's gonna fight back.

475
00:25:08,170 --> 00:25:11,610
So if we feel that there's a
case, that's a righteous case.

476
00:25:11,730 --> 00:25:14,850
I don't care who it is, who the
defendant is, We are gonna

477
00:25:14,850 --> 00:25:16,890
represent the victim because
that's what we do.

478
00:25:17,610 --> 00:25:21,530
One of your reset posts on
LinkedIn that I really like.

479
00:25:21,530 --> 00:25:24,130
We should post about Kanye West
or correction.

480
00:25:24,130 --> 00:25:30,910
Yay, twist it up.
You and ya are because of the

481
00:25:30,910 --> 00:25:34,550
multiple cases that you had
against him or, you know,

482
00:25:34,550 --> 00:25:36,230
defending people who worked for
him.

483
00:25:36,830 --> 00:25:42,390
Yeah, I spent a lot of time
litigating against Lay Yay or

484
00:25:42,390 --> 00:25:44,830
Kanye, the artist formerly known
as Kanye West.

485
00:25:45,190 --> 00:25:50,350
So we represent several of the
teachers of the Donda Academy

486
00:25:50,710 --> 00:25:56,270
that he founded, folks that he
recruited and ultimately fired

487
00:25:56,990 --> 00:25:59,860
because they stood up for the
students.

488
00:25:59,860 --> 00:26:02,100
You know, if you kind of read
the allegations and the

489
00:26:02,100 --> 00:26:05,540
complaint, Kanye didn't like
windows, Kids were eating on the

490
00:26:05,540 --> 00:26:08,940
floor or eating sushi.
And the teacher said, whoa, this

491
00:26:08,940 --> 00:26:11,300
isn't right, this isn't safe.
It was exposed to electrical

492
00:26:11,300 --> 00:26:12,860
wire.
And when they complained, you

493
00:26:12,860 --> 00:26:15,460
know, he would just fire.
The thing is, we also represent.

494
00:26:15,460 --> 00:26:18,540
We're mandated reporters.
We have to say things if we

495
00:26:18,540 --> 00:26:21,460
think kids are in danger.
It's kind of part of the job.

496
00:26:21,940 --> 00:26:24,820
Oh, absolutely.
I mean, as you know, teachers,

497
00:26:24,820 --> 00:26:28,440
doctors, I mean, you have to
report any safety issue and the

498
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,720
allegation of abuse.
So, you know, we're fortunate to

499
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:38,160
be representing those former
employees of Kanye and Donda, we

500
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:42,840
have another employee of his
that was, you know, kind of a

501
00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:49,480
contractor, security guard that
we recently filed, not a

502
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:50,840
teacher.
A different case.

503
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:54,000
You know, I was a legal
commentator on the Kanye and Kim

504
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:57,800
documentary for HBO, so and the
part of it's just kind of being

505
00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:00,760
in LA and around all this small
legal community.

506
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:05,360
But I've had to spend a lot of
time learning about Kanye West

507
00:27:05,360 --> 00:27:09,640
recently.
I maybe more than you ever

508
00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:13,440
wanted to know, I'm sure.
I'm sure you know when it's

509
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,680
folks like Lizzo and Kanye,
usually it's not the first and

510
00:27:16,680 --> 00:27:20,320
it won't be the last, so.
That's sad though, especially

511
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:22,320
like people that a lot of people
look up to.

512
00:27:22,750 --> 00:27:25,150
And I know they say, you know,
never meet your idols, They'll

513
00:27:25,150 --> 00:27:28,910
let you down, yada yada.
But there's not a, like, the

514
00:27:28,910 --> 00:27:31,950
whole country's kind of in a
crisis right now financially.

515
00:27:32,630 --> 00:27:36,390
I mean, you see what's going on
with the state of the the, the

516
00:27:36,390 --> 00:27:38,470
country and figuring out our
finances.

517
00:27:38,950 --> 00:27:40,590
That was supposed to be done
three months ago.

518
00:27:40,910 --> 00:27:42,750
But you know what I mean?
So like, people want a little

519
00:27:42,750 --> 00:27:47,230
bit of something good to listen
to or hold on to, and then you

520
00:27:47,230 --> 00:27:50,790
find out that the the person you
like or the music you like is

521
00:27:50,790 --> 00:27:55,390
made by somebody who's.
Awful, You know, it's it is sad,

522
00:27:55,390 --> 00:27:57,630
I agree.
But you know, this is really our

523
00:27:57,630 --> 00:28:00,830
system of justice.
So but I'm not going to put

524
00:28:01,070 --> 00:28:05,270
Kanye West or Liz O in jail.
It's not a criminal case, right?

525
00:28:05,550 --> 00:28:08,750
So when someone harms someone,
right, someone sexually harasses

526
00:28:08,750 --> 00:28:12,710
someone, someone discriminates
against their race or their

527
00:28:12,710 --> 00:28:18,070
medical condition, our civil
justice system, all there is, is

528
00:28:18,390 --> 00:28:20,870
the payment of money damages.
That's it.

529
00:28:21,230 --> 00:28:24,790
There's nothing else I can do to
Kanye and Lizzo.

530
00:28:24,790 --> 00:28:30,470
I can't make Lizzo eat a dirty
banana, you know, out of one of

531
00:28:30,470 --> 00:28:35,270
the, you know, sex show workers
in Amsterdam.

532
00:28:35,270 --> 00:28:38,350
Like some of the things she was
making, some of her employees

533
00:28:38,350 --> 00:28:40,830
do, allegedly.
It's just it's not an eye for an

534
00:28:40,830 --> 00:28:44,290
eye system.
All I can do is they can tell

535
00:28:44,290 --> 00:28:46,810
their story and a jury decides,
listen, you've been harmed.

536
00:28:46,810 --> 00:28:48,570
This is how much I think the
harm is worth.

537
00:28:48,570 --> 00:28:52,730
So people say, oh, this is just
about money and you know, some

538
00:28:52,730 --> 00:28:56,090
money grab like that's the only
option that we have.

539
00:28:56,090 --> 00:29:00,130
If you've been harmed by your
employer, if you've been hurt by

540
00:29:00,130 --> 00:29:03,490
someone, even if the police kill
someone you know, if it's an

541
00:29:03,570 --> 00:29:06,910
accident, you still might be
negligent.

542
00:29:06,910 --> 00:29:08,590
I mean, all you can get is
money.

543
00:29:08,590 --> 00:29:11,550
Now obviously, look, if you're
talking about criminal conduct,

544
00:29:11,550 --> 00:29:13,150
that's an entirely different
story.

545
00:29:13,270 --> 00:29:15,310
But most of these cases that
we're talking about, it's just

546
00:29:15,310 --> 00:29:16,870
not criminal.
It's civil and civil.

547
00:29:16,870 --> 00:29:19,310
The remedy is money.
Now you do a lot of commentary.

548
00:29:19,310 --> 00:29:23,350
So have you heard about this
Disney lawsuit that's people are

549
00:29:23,350 --> 00:29:27,030
talking about right now?
Somebody what lawsuit are we

550
00:29:27,030 --> 00:29:28,270
talking?
About this is the one about the

551
00:29:28,270 --> 00:29:31,470
water slide that the the lady it
was.

552
00:29:31,950 --> 00:29:34,710
Well, OK, so the press is
saying.

553
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:39,160
You know, it's over a wedgie,
but oh, this is a wedgie.

554
00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:43,600
Wait, I mean, this person had
like, their intestines go where

555
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:47,200
they weren't supposed to.
That's like, yeah, I did.

556
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,600
I did read about this one.
This is just in the past day or

557
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:52,320
so.
Yeah, I did read about this.

558
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,240
What I will say is, look, I
represented Disney.

559
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,220
And no, I, I, I I've been on
both sides.

560
00:29:59,620 --> 00:30:02,260
I could say that.
Listen, jurors really like

561
00:30:02,340 --> 00:30:05,380
Disney, at least here in
California where I am, they they

562
00:30:05,380 --> 00:30:09,700
tend to win a lot of the time.
So I am not saying that the

563
00:30:09,700 --> 00:30:12,860
wedgie didn't happen.
I'm not saying that the person

564
00:30:12,860 --> 00:30:14,620
wasn't hurt.
They may well be hurt.

565
00:30:14,620 --> 00:30:17,580
It might be a completely
legitimate case.

566
00:30:17,580 --> 00:30:22,020
But Disney's one of those
defendants that jurors like, so

567
00:30:22,220 --> 00:30:23,980
that's that big case.
They go to trial.

568
00:30:24,340 --> 00:30:26,420
You could better have your
experts that are going to

569
00:30:26,420 --> 00:30:28,460
support what you're saying
because the jurors think it's

570
00:30:28,460 --> 00:30:30,940
just a wedgie.
It's not a good case, obviously,

571
00:30:30,940 --> 00:30:34,380
if there's that abdominal
issues, GI issues, I mean if

572
00:30:34,380 --> 00:30:36,540
there's serious medical problems
caused by this and there's a

573
00:30:36,540 --> 00:30:38,260
failure to warrant, then it is a
good case.

574
00:30:38,940 --> 00:30:43,500
Yeah, as soon as I saw, like the
way the media referenced it, I

575
00:30:43,500 --> 00:30:46,500
mean, my mind went straight back
to McDonald's.

576
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:48,080
And coffee.
And I went.

577
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:51,640
That was one of those cases that
when I learned what it actually

578
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:55,160
was about, I was horrified.
Yeah, I mean, people don't

579
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:57,400
realize.
I mean, that McDonald's coffee

580
00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:01,120
case, that was serious burns,
real serious injuries.

581
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:04,120
It's not like, you know, you
spilled some coffee and you got,

582
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:06,120
you're closed or you got like a
dry cleanup.

583
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:11,120
I mean, you know, I think the
insurance industry and these

584
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:14,880
corporate defendants, they have
a lot of money and they spend

585
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:18,220
it, you know, trying to argue
that all these cases are

586
00:31:18,220 --> 00:31:19,940
frivolous.
And look, I'm not saying there

587
00:31:19,940 --> 00:31:22,540
aren't some frivolous cases.
Like people lie, people do

588
00:31:22,540 --> 00:31:26,180
things for money.
We as lawyers try to vet through

589
00:31:26,180 --> 00:31:27,740
that.
And like I said, hopefully

590
00:31:27,740 --> 00:31:30,780
that's in the 90 plus percent of
cases we reject.

591
00:31:30,780 --> 00:31:34,860
But there are some people that
are really, really hurt by

592
00:31:34,860 --> 00:31:39,020
corporations and their lives are
forever changed and they're

593
00:31:39,020 --> 00:31:43,860
entitled to justice and not, you
know, anything less.

594
00:31:43,940 --> 00:31:47,150
Because I'll tell you this, I
mean, Brittany, every single one

595
00:31:47,150 --> 00:31:50,550
of my clients, every single one,
I ended the Case No matter how

596
00:31:50,550 --> 00:31:53,070
much money they got.
They say, you know what, Nima, I

597
00:31:53,070 --> 00:31:55,070
would give this all back if this
never happened.

598
00:31:55,430 --> 00:31:57,510
I don't feel pain if I don't
have to suffer the rest of my

599
00:31:57,510 --> 00:31:59,990
life.
I mean, there's no dollar

600
00:31:59,990 --> 00:32:01,270
amount.
I didn't lose a loved one.

601
00:32:01,270 --> 00:32:03,710
I don't have to suffer this
embarrassment, this harassment,

602
00:32:03,710 --> 00:32:08,270
this discrimination.
So, you know, I would be wary of

603
00:32:08,270 --> 00:32:11,990
corporations that try to avoid
responsibility by trying to

604
00:32:11,990 --> 00:32:14,760
frame all these clients.
That's frivolous.

605
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:19,240
Are there any companies that you
think do the right thing usually

606
00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:21,000
like?
You could say offhand, like

607
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:23,200
these guys usually handle things
correctly.

608
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:26,720
Yeah, I will say that there are
some companies that I've never

609
00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:30,200
sued.
They have really good compliance

610
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,200
in place, right?
But some companies, I sue a lot

611
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:37,000
more because they'll just cut
corners and they don't care, you

612
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:42,870
know, about sexual harassment
training and racial sensitivity

613
00:32:42,870 --> 00:32:45,430
training and kind of doing the
right thing that's required by

614
00:32:45,430 --> 00:32:47,470
the law.
You know, same thing with, you

615
00:32:47,470 --> 00:32:48,750
know, certain insurance
companies.

616
00:32:48,750 --> 00:32:51,750
There's some that, you know,
make a claim, they pay the

617
00:32:51,750 --> 00:32:55,350
claim, you know, and I've never
just sue one of their clients

618
00:32:56,030 --> 00:32:59,830
because they do the right thing.
There's some insurance companies

619
00:33:00,260 --> 00:33:04,060
that will lowball or deny the
claims and we got to sue them

620
00:33:04,060 --> 00:33:06,660
all the time.
So it's really kind of a top

621
00:33:06,660 --> 00:33:08,780
down thing and it depends on the
defendant, depends on the

622
00:33:08,780 --> 00:33:11,100
company.
OK, yeah.

623
00:33:11,260 --> 00:33:13,860
I just, I don't know.
I think it's like a regular

624
00:33:13,860 --> 00:33:16,540
person.
It's kind of scary.

625
00:33:16,900 --> 00:33:21,020
And I know a lot of people just
opt to quit or, you know, leave

626
00:33:21,020 --> 00:33:24,820
a company because the idea of
having to get an attorney and do

627
00:33:24,820 --> 00:33:27,820
what your team would need to do
for them just seems.

628
00:33:28,470 --> 00:33:33,350
Financially impossible for
regular people and lawyers are

629
00:33:33,350 --> 00:33:36,150
so expensive.
You know, when I was doing

630
00:33:36,150 --> 00:33:38,990
defense work, you know, the
monthly bills were sometimes

631
00:33:38,990 --> 00:33:42,590
millions of dollars a month, not
to say our cases would be that

632
00:33:42,590 --> 00:33:45,350
much.
But lawyers, even the cheapest

633
00:33:45,350 --> 00:33:47,110
lawyers are going to cost you
thousands of dollars.

634
00:33:47,190 --> 00:33:50,230
And that's just the bottom line.
You know, minimum, minimum start

635
00:33:50,230 --> 00:33:52,990
going to trial 10s earning
hundreds of thousands of

636
00:33:52,990 --> 00:33:56,550
dollars.
So you know what we do is we

637
00:33:57,300 --> 00:33:59,820
don't charge anything upfront.
We're only paid if we win.

638
00:34:00,260 --> 00:34:02,580
So we have an, we have an
interest in the case and if

639
00:34:02,580 --> 00:34:05,500
there's any cost, court costs,
experts, everything, we advance

640
00:34:05,500 --> 00:34:07,220
all that.
So we accept your case.

641
00:34:07,420 --> 00:34:10,540
You're not going to pay anything
out of pocket if we lose, Well,

642
00:34:10,540 --> 00:34:12,900
we'll lose once in a while,
rarely, but we lose.

643
00:34:13,540 --> 00:34:16,780
We absorb all the costs.
The client will never ever be

644
00:34:16,780 --> 00:34:18,060
out of pocket.
They don't have to pay us for

645
00:34:18,060 --> 00:34:20,340
attorney fees.
And if we win, then we get paid

646
00:34:20,699 --> 00:34:23,219
and you know, the costs are
repaid, but we advance

647
00:34:23,219 --> 00:34:26,020
everything.
So you know, I I tell folks that

648
00:34:27,050 --> 00:34:31,409
obviously crying a lawyer is an
important choice, but at least

649
00:34:31,449 --> 00:34:35,810
if you're hiring us, the
finances aren't something that

650
00:34:35,810 --> 00:34:40,090
you have to worry about because
it's a no risk situation to you.

651
00:34:41,969 --> 00:34:45,929
Now, since you deal a lot with
people who are working, do you

652
00:34:45,929 --> 00:34:50,650
have advice for people who who
might find themself in that

653
00:34:50,650 --> 00:34:52,650
position?
Like you feel like you're

654
00:34:52,650 --> 00:34:54,290
layered.
It's your job.

655
00:34:54,810 --> 00:34:57,170
Did something that they
shouldn't have, whether it be

656
00:34:57,170 --> 00:35:00,650
discrimination, you know,
violence, anything like that,

657
00:35:00,650 --> 00:35:04,450
Yeah.
My number one advice in any type

658
00:35:04,450 --> 00:35:10,250
of case is contact a lawyer,
most of them in our space, they

659
00:35:10,250 --> 00:35:14,570
will offer a free consultation.
OK, trying to handle a case on

660
00:35:14,570 --> 00:35:17,130
your own.
It can be a Fender Bender.

661
00:35:17,130 --> 00:35:20,450
It can be a workplace issue dog,
but it's the worst thing you

662
00:35:20,450 --> 00:35:24,280
could do, you know, just like, I
don't know, I'm not gonna go fix

663
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:28,520
my own car, You know, I'm not
gonna go, you know, clean my own

664
00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:30,120
teeth.
And you know, it's just, I

665
00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:31,440
think, a mistake.
People try to handle these

666
00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:32,880
claims on their own.
Look, I get it.

667
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:36,360
People don't like lawyers as a
distrust of lawyers, but we

668
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:38,800
really kind of want to make, and
the reason I do a lot of what I

669
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:41,930
do, the commentary and the
social media, is I want to make

670
00:35:41,930 --> 00:35:44,370
a law understandable.
I want to make it accessible,

671
00:35:44,370 --> 00:35:47,090
and I want people to pick up the
phone, you know, if there's an

672
00:35:47,090 --> 00:35:49,570
issue.
Because a lot of the problems we

673
00:35:49,570 --> 00:35:53,090
see are employers or companies,
insurance or otherwise, that

674
00:35:53,090 --> 00:35:54,850
take advantage of people,
whether they're not represented.

675
00:35:54,850 --> 00:35:57,170
So that's my number one advice.
Talk to a lawyer.

676
00:35:57,570 --> 00:36:03,250
My #2 is if there is an issue at
work, you know, you got to

677
00:36:03,250 --> 00:36:05,650
document it.
You know, you got to report it

678
00:36:05,690 --> 00:36:08,130
to HR.
A lot of the claims are based on

679
00:36:08,130 --> 00:36:10,210
notice, right?
So something's going on behind

680
00:36:10,210 --> 00:36:12,350
the scenes.
Someone's being racist,

681
00:36:12,350 --> 00:36:14,830
someone's actually harassing
you, you know?

682
00:36:14,870 --> 00:36:18,430
And the complaint doesn't
happen, or it's verbal.

683
00:36:19,070 --> 00:36:20,990
It's not the same as a written
complaint.

684
00:36:20,990 --> 00:36:22,470
So those are my two pieces of
advice.

685
00:36:22,470 --> 00:36:24,750
Consult the lawyer and make sure
everything's in writing.

686
00:36:25,950 --> 00:36:28,910
All right.
Now, I want to pivot a little

687
00:36:28,910 --> 00:36:32,710
bit because one of the things
that I think both you and I care

688
00:36:32,710 --> 00:36:36,790
a lot about are wrongful
imprisonment in the United

689
00:36:36,790 --> 00:36:39,230
States.
And I definitely would like to

690
00:36:39,630 --> 00:36:41,710
talk to someone about that.
Yeah.

691
00:36:41,710 --> 00:36:43,790
I mean, obviously as a
prosecutor, my greatest

692
00:36:43,790 --> 00:36:46,950
nightmare was to put an innocent
person in jail.

693
00:36:46,950 --> 00:36:54,030
I was a big believer in Justice
Blackstone's theory, and he was

694
00:36:54,030 --> 00:36:57,430
a a judge way back in the UK
many years ago.

695
00:36:57,430 --> 00:37:01,430
But he said that it's better
that 10 guilty men go free than

696
00:37:01,430 --> 00:37:05,750
one innocent person suffer.
And obviously it was olden days.

697
00:37:05,750 --> 00:37:08,510
So they're talking about men.
But, you know, if I had any

698
00:37:08,510 --> 00:37:12,840
doubt in my mind about a
defendant's guilt or innocence,

699
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:14,880
I would not prosecute that
person.

700
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:17,120
Now, I'm not saying all
prosecutors are the same.

701
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:21,000
And innocent people are
convicted in this country all

702
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:23,240
the time.
And there's guilty people that

703
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:26,040
get away and there's guilty
people that say they're innocent

704
00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:30,360
when they're not innocent.
So, you know, I hope that, you

705
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:32,880
know, if there's any prosecutors
out there listening or law

706
00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:35,880
enforcement types and they have
any doubt, listen, just do the

707
00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:38,760
right thing.
It's better to let the person go

708
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:41,620
than to wrongfully convicted
innocent person.

709
00:37:42,460 --> 00:37:46,980
Now, are you connected to any of
the organizations that work on

710
00:37:46,980 --> 00:37:48,460
that right now?
Obviously everybody knows the

711
00:37:48,460 --> 00:37:50,820
Innocence Project, but there's a
lot of other ones too.

712
00:37:51,380 --> 00:37:53,180
Yeah, I mean, they do great
work.

713
00:37:53,300 --> 00:37:54,820
I don't do any criminal work
anymore.

714
00:37:54,820 --> 00:37:57,340
I'm one of the few prosecutors
that I don't touch criminal

715
00:37:57,340 --> 00:38:00,980
offence, so I'm only doing civil
plaintiffs work.

716
00:38:00,980 --> 00:38:04,220
But yeah, I mean, I will
represent victims if they've

717
00:38:04,220 --> 00:38:09,060
been wrongfully accused and
exonerated and because the

718
00:38:09,060 --> 00:38:13,820
police misconduct.
So, you know, we do have some

719
00:38:13,900 --> 00:38:17,900
cases that are like a kind of a
criminal component or the D A's

720
00:38:17,900 --> 00:38:24,340
office is prosecuting, you know,
the person who's responsible for

721
00:38:24,340 --> 00:38:26,660
like a sexual assault or rape or
something of that effect.

722
00:38:26,660 --> 00:38:28,620
But I'm just not doing criminal
offense work.

723
00:38:28,620 --> 00:38:32,750
Because even though those people
are innocent, I just like being

724
00:38:32,750 --> 00:38:35,150
on offense.
It's just a personal decision as

725
00:38:35,150 --> 00:38:39,230
opposed to being on defense.
It feels like I think I saw

726
00:38:39,230 --> 00:38:41,230
something recently that said
that something along the lines

727
00:38:41,230 --> 00:38:47,230
of like only 3% of criminal
cases are ever closed and that

728
00:38:47,230 --> 00:38:52,590
just feels like a real breadth
of cases that are criminals are

729
00:38:52,590 --> 00:38:57,110
just doing things.
I mean, how do we get better at

730
00:38:57,150 --> 00:38:59,070
that number?
How do we do better at getting

731
00:38:59,070 --> 00:39:02,100
more convictions?
And not messing up.

732
00:39:02,340 --> 00:39:04,540
I mean, you're talking.
Yeah, you're talking to a former

733
00:39:04,540 --> 00:39:07,580
prosecutor, right.
So, you know, I think a lot of

734
00:39:07,580 --> 00:39:09,620
people should be prosecuted.
I think a lot of cases aren't

735
00:39:09,620 --> 00:39:11,020
prosecuted.
That should be.

736
00:39:11,780 --> 00:39:15,580
I think if you break the law,
you know, you there should be

737
00:39:15,580 --> 00:39:19,220
some accountability.
So if you're talking to someone

738
00:39:19,220 --> 00:39:24,740
that thinks there should be more
prosecutions, I'm on that side

739
00:39:24,980 --> 00:39:29,060
because I think it's important
to keep to, to keep people safe

740
00:39:29,450 --> 00:39:33,130
and to make sure that
perpetrators pay a price for

741
00:39:33,130 --> 00:39:35,450
what they've done.
And I guess I have to ask this

742
00:39:35,450 --> 00:39:38,170
cuz I feel like it's the same
kind of question I would have

743
00:39:38,170 --> 00:39:40,250
asked my parents.
How do you feel about

744
00:39:40,250 --> 00:39:42,410
executions?
It's hard.

745
00:39:42,530 --> 00:39:45,250
You know.
I think on one hand, like I

746
00:39:45,250 --> 00:39:50,130
said, you never ever, ever wanna
execute an innocent person.

747
00:39:50,370 --> 00:39:53,610
Right.
That's like the worst of all.

748
00:39:53,690 --> 00:39:58,590
And the problem.
So, you know, in theory, yeah,

749
00:39:58,590 --> 00:40:02,870
if someone, like, kills my wife
or my kids, I would want them to

750
00:40:02,870 --> 00:40:05,230
die.
You know, the the question is,

751
00:40:05,350 --> 00:40:08,270
you know, is the death penalty
from like a public policy

752
00:40:08,270 --> 00:40:08,830
reason?
So.

753
00:40:08,830 --> 00:40:12,430
So that's my person, right?
You asked me, someone hurts my

754
00:40:12,430 --> 00:40:15,350
wife and kids.
I want them to, you know, not

755
00:40:15,350 --> 00:40:17,030
life.
And no, absolutely.

756
00:40:17,830 --> 00:40:20,430
You know, so then the question
is okay, Are innocent people

757
00:40:20,430 --> 00:40:25,430
ever sentenced to death?
Is there a racial component

758
00:40:25,430 --> 00:40:26,390
right?
Where?

759
00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:30,720
Disproportionately black men or
put to death or you know, people

760
00:40:30,720 --> 00:40:36,880
of color are death penalty
qualified lawyers getting the

761
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:40,720
resources that they need, you
know, are jurors considering

762
00:40:40,720 --> 00:40:44,000
mitigation.
So it's really tough, I'd say

763
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:47,280
personally all about it, But
from a public policy

764
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:52,440
perspective, I totally
understand why people in states

765
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:55,640
like mine, like California,
people in the legislature,

766
00:40:55,930 --> 00:40:59,810
people who are prosecutors, they
don't believe in it.

767
00:40:59,890 --> 00:41:02,490
It's one of those things I I
really do understand both sides.

768
00:41:02,530 --> 00:41:04,730
And the second?
It's for public policy and and

769
00:41:04,730 --> 00:41:07,130
criminal justice reasons.
Yeah, I feel like in, you know,

770
00:41:07,130 --> 00:41:09,410
cases that are the big ones,
like, you know, the big serial

771
00:41:09,410 --> 00:41:14,930
killers from the 70s where they
had, you know, just giant piles

772
00:41:14,930 --> 00:41:19,210
of evidence that could all be,
you know, definitively linked,

773
00:41:19,490 --> 00:41:21,930
totally understand that one,
but.

774
00:41:22,950 --> 00:41:25,910
On the other hand, like you
said, I mean, when we know that

775
00:41:26,150 --> 00:41:29,110
there are people who don't get a
fair shake because they're poor

776
00:41:29,350 --> 00:41:33,110
or they're an immigrant or
they're a part of a marginalized

777
00:41:33,110 --> 00:41:36,790
group, then my my brain goes,
this doesn't feel right.

778
00:41:38,910 --> 00:41:40,870
Yeah.
And you really would want it to

779
00:41:40,870 --> 00:41:45,110
be for the worst of the worst
and not just because.

780
00:41:45,630 --> 00:41:49,540
And again, I'm not saying that
anyone's making decisions for

781
00:41:49,540 --> 00:41:52,940
racially motivated reasons, but
I mean, we can talk on the

782
00:41:52,940 --> 00:41:55,860
Racism is real.
You know, implicit biases are

783
00:41:55,860 --> 00:41:58,460
real.
I mean, it would be naive for me

784
00:41:58,460 --> 00:42:02,100
to ignore all that just so.
Yeah, you know, justice is

785
00:42:02,100 --> 00:42:03,540
colorblind.
I wish it was.

786
00:42:03,780 --> 00:42:06,500
I mean, I'm an Iranian American,
even though I was born here,

787
00:42:06,500 --> 00:42:09,180
I've dealt with racism myself at
the Department of Justice.

788
00:42:09,180 --> 00:42:14,300
So you know, I I understand the
arguments on both sides.

789
00:42:14,300 --> 00:42:16,020
No, I definitely do too.
It's just.

790
00:42:17,810 --> 00:42:20,490
I think it's just, it's always
whenever I see these cases pop

791
00:42:20,490 --> 00:42:26,250
up with someone, you know, 25
years, 20 years, and there was

792
00:42:26,250 --> 00:42:29,130
absolutely nothing behind it.
It just, it just hits my heart.

793
00:42:29,130 --> 00:42:33,650
Like here's a person who lost a
huge chunk of their life and

794
00:42:33,650 --> 00:42:36,410
there's no restitution for that.
Like, what could you give that

795
00:42:36,410 --> 00:42:40,930
person that would make them
happy when you stole a third of

796
00:42:40,930 --> 00:42:42,450
their life?
Yeah.

797
00:42:42,450 --> 00:42:45,090
If you're talking about the
folks that are convicted, you

798
00:42:45,090 --> 00:42:47,270
know, that are innocent.
Yeah.

799
00:42:47,270 --> 00:42:51,230
I mean it's it's incredibly sad
and it's a miscarriage of

800
00:42:51,230 --> 00:42:54,070
justice and it's just like I
said, my nightmare as a

801
00:42:54,070 --> 00:42:57,230
prosecutor.
So far, no one's ever come back

802
00:42:57,830 --> 00:43:00,510
more than 1000 people and said
that they were innocent, thank

803
00:43:00,510 --> 00:43:02,230
God.
Or they said they're innocent,

804
00:43:02,230 --> 00:43:05,630
but no one's been proven
innocent or there's been no kind

805
00:43:05,630 --> 00:43:09,750
of credible claim of innocence.
But no, it's it's a it's a huge

806
00:43:09,750 --> 00:43:11,590
problem.
You know, on the other side.

807
00:43:11,910 --> 00:43:15,030
Think of all the victims that
have lost loved ones and never

808
00:43:15,350 --> 00:43:16,670
got any cases, have never been
solved.

809
00:43:17,050 --> 00:43:19,450
Yeah.
Yeah, Cold case killers.

810
00:43:19,770 --> 00:43:24,010
And, you know, so it's I wish I
had an answer.

811
00:43:24,290 --> 00:43:27,050
You know, unfortunately as
lawyers we're in the business of

812
00:43:27,050 --> 00:43:30,210
misery.
And I cover these murder cases

813
00:43:30,330 --> 00:43:32,330
every week.
You know, different ones,

814
00:43:32,570 --> 00:43:35,770
terrible, terrible cases.
And doesn't make it any easier

815
00:43:35,770 --> 00:43:38,930
when I hear the victims, you
know, the loved ones who could

816
00:43:38,930 --> 00:43:43,500
understand, they testify how
important they're their

817
00:43:43,500 --> 00:43:47,060
children, their their spouse,
their sibling was to them.

818
00:43:48,380 --> 00:43:53,140
One of the things that I I saw
you comment on fairly recently

819
00:43:53,900 --> 00:44:01,980
was parents of school shooters
are getting felony charges now.

820
00:44:02,580 --> 00:44:06,260
I'm very much for it, honestly.
I think.

821
00:44:06,940 --> 00:44:10,100
Yeah, I mean, yeah, that's
something that, you know, I've

822
00:44:10,100 --> 00:44:12,100
been talking about.
You know, obviously there there

823
00:44:12,100 --> 00:44:14,620
was the biggest case really is
the crumbly case in Michigan.

824
00:44:14,860 --> 00:44:18,940
But you know, there's the case
in North Carolina where, you

825
00:44:19,100 --> 00:44:21,500
know, 6 year old got a gun, the
teacher.

826
00:44:21,500 --> 00:44:22,860
So we're seeing it more and more
now.

827
00:44:23,660 --> 00:44:26,180
Yeah, teacher was shot.
And the guy it's so hard to be a

828
00:44:26,180 --> 00:44:29,420
teacher as is, you know, you're
working for not a whole lot of

829
00:44:29,420 --> 00:44:30,980
money.
You're talking to a preschool

830
00:44:30,980 --> 00:44:36,370
teacher, Neema.
I mean, you're doing God's work,

831
00:44:36,970 --> 00:44:39,450
but it's it's not for a lot of
money, so I know.

832
00:44:39,530 --> 00:44:42,690
Love my students, but I would
love a good paycheck.

833
00:44:43,850 --> 00:44:46,170
Yeah.
So to kind of put yourself at

834
00:44:46,570 --> 00:44:50,970
risk of being shot on top of it,
not only preschoolers are going

835
00:44:50,970 --> 00:44:54,650
to be shooting you, but but, you
know, being a teacher is not an

836
00:44:54,650 --> 00:44:57,370
easy job.
So, you know, I think on one

837
00:44:57,370 --> 00:45:01,090
hand we're seeing a little bit
of a shift in prosecutors and

838
00:45:01,090 --> 00:45:02,570
we've seen this in different
types of cases.

839
00:45:02,570 --> 00:45:04,540
Right.
So you know historically

840
00:45:04,540 --> 00:45:06,020
prosecutors, they're risk
averse.

841
00:45:06,060 --> 00:45:08,900
They don't want to lose.
They're expected to win every

842
00:45:08,900 --> 00:45:10,980
time.
That's why for years in this in

843
00:45:10,980 --> 00:45:13,500
this country, you didn't see
police officers prosecuting

844
00:45:13,820 --> 00:45:16,620
because I'm the Rodney King,
right?

845
00:45:16,660 --> 00:45:20,260
I mean he's the officers are
acquitted the first time around

846
00:45:20,260 --> 00:45:22,820
and the feds retry the case and
then I think they get two or the

847
00:45:22,820 --> 00:45:26,420
four.
But I mean, the defense verdict

848
00:45:26,420 --> 00:45:29,340
rate and police misconduct
cases, I mean, defendants would

849
00:45:29,340 --> 00:45:32,700
win all the time.
And prosecutors, I don't like

850
00:45:32,700 --> 00:45:34,380
losing.
I don't like taking tough cases

851
00:45:35,220 --> 00:45:38,900
or or representing, you know,
rape victims, right, Because

852
00:45:38,900 --> 00:45:40,820
often times it's that, he said.
She said.

853
00:45:40,820 --> 00:45:43,820
So this is a delayed report, but
we're seeing a shift right now.

854
00:45:43,820 --> 00:45:46,140
Prosecutors are being more
aggressive.

855
00:45:46,420 --> 00:45:49,860
They're they're taking on
difficult cases if they're

856
00:45:50,980 --> 00:45:54,460
righteous cases, right.
So I think some of it is that.

857
00:45:54,460 --> 00:45:57,940
But really, in this interview I
did with Fox, I think one of the

858
00:45:57,940 --> 00:46:02,230
big differences we're seeing is
just there is a lot more

859
00:46:02,230 --> 00:46:05,470
evidence right now.
So I said, what would Derek

860
00:46:05,470 --> 00:46:09,470
Chauvin have been prosecuted for
George Floyd if the whole world

861
00:46:09,470 --> 00:46:10,430
didn't catch it on?
Yeah.

862
00:46:10,550 --> 00:46:13,950
There were at least 20 different
angles of crime.

863
00:46:13,950 --> 00:46:16,630
Yeah, maybe not.
Yeah, maybe not.

864
00:46:16,670 --> 00:46:18,550
Maybe be a free man.
Right now, I mean, I remember

865
00:46:18,550 --> 00:46:20,070
and I think in some of these
cases.

866
00:46:20,110 --> 00:46:21,910
Baltimore.
Do you remember that case with

867
00:46:21,910 --> 00:46:24,350
the guy whose neck?
What is his name?

868
00:46:25,150 --> 00:46:28,150
Yeah, I mean, his spine was
severed because he wasn't

869
00:46:28,150 --> 00:46:30,350
properly secured in the back of
the vehicle.

870
00:46:30,810 --> 00:46:33,050
That was a huge case.
Yeah.

871
00:46:33,210 --> 00:46:39,450
As I'm a huge believer in body
cams for all police officers, I

872
00:46:39,450 --> 00:46:41,770
like cameras, ever, cameras in
the courtroom, Everything should

873
00:46:41,770 --> 00:46:45,890
be ever, never, never.
I mean, it protects the officer,

874
00:46:45,890 --> 00:46:49,610
protects the public defendants.
But you know, kind of going back

875
00:46:49,610 --> 00:46:52,330
to your question, I think the
reason we're seeing these

876
00:46:52,330 --> 00:46:54,130
prosecutions more and more is
because there's just more

877
00:46:54,210 --> 00:46:57,210
evidence.
You know, you have the Crumblies

878
00:46:57,490 --> 00:47:01,390
buying their get a gun, I think
it was for Christmas, right, or

879
00:47:01,390 --> 00:47:04,230
the holidays, post it, posting
it on social, posting on

880
00:47:04,230 --> 00:47:09,470
Facebook, you know, a 16 year
old kid, you know, and so you're

881
00:47:09,470 --> 00:47:13,070
seeing more evidence in these
cases because of social media,

882
00:47:13,070 --> 00:47:15,870
because of cameras.
That really gives prosecutors a

883
00:47:15,870 --> 00:47:20,150
little bit of of an advantage.
I don't think that case we

884
00:47:20,150 --> 00:47:26,430
prosecuted had there not been so
much public information about

885
00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:29,120
Ethan.
You know, the school told the

886
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,760
parents, hey, he's searching for
ammunition on his phone, you

887
00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:35,680
know, he's drawing.
These are kind of terrible

888
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:39,120
things, you know.
So once the parents are on

889
00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:41,960
notice, they can't say, well, we
didn't know, like, how can we

890
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:43,760
responsible?
Because normally criminal

891
00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:48,240
conduct, it's not like civil,
like in the civil context, Lizo

892
00:47:48,240 --> 00:47:51,640
is liable for the misconduct of
her employees.

893
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:53,640
That's just as a matter of what.
You're the boss.

894
00:47:53,640 --> 00:47:55,580
You're responsible.
That's on the civil side,

895
00:47:55,860 --> 00:47:58,100
criminal.
It's all about your own conduct,

896
00:47:58,380 --> 00:48:00,260
Okay.
So like, what did you do?

897
00:48:00,780 --> 00:48:04,140
And in this particular case,
look, the parents were told that

898
00:48:04,140 --> 00:48:05,900
the son is dangerous.
Hey, do you want to get him?

899
00:48:05,900 --> 00:48:07,460
Do you want to give him some
mental health treatment?

900
00:48:07,460 --> 00:48:09,860
He's just a kid.
And they chose to ignore it.

901
00:48:09,860 --> 00:48:12,620
So the argument is, look, you're
playing Russian roulette with

902
00:48:12,620 --> 00:48:14,340
people's lives and you should be
held accountable.

903
00:48:14,340 --> 00:48:16,860
Yeah, well, I mean, it's the
fact that they got called into

904
00:48:16,860 --> 00:48:19,340
school that morning and then
they were like, we're not taking

905
00:48:19,340 --> 00:48:22,240
him home, just you could have
just taken him.

906
00:48:22,240 --> 00:48:24,840
Home that would have saved 4
people's lives.

907
00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:30,400
At least that day it would have.
And look, if you have a gun,

908
00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:34,440
it's your responsibility as an
adult to keep it locked up.

909
00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:38,400
Yeah, there's no way Your kid.
Yeah, I mean, your kid should be

910
00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:40,960
like, how many gun deaths there
are in this country because kids

911
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:43,700
get access to guns.
Like how many suicide, forget

912
00:48:43,700 --> 00:48:45,020
even the accident on the
suicide.

913
00:48:45,020 --> 00:48:47,900
There's so many gun related
suicides because kids get access

914
00:48:47,900 --> 00:48:50,180
to their parents.
You know, I'm not saying they

915
00:48:50,180 --> 00:48:52,420
wouldn't have killed themselves
some other way, Maybe they would

916
00:48:52,420 --> 00:48:55,340
have.
But like your job as a parent is

917
00:48:55,460 --> 00:48:57,140
you have a gun, you got to keep
it locked.

918
00:48:57,260 --> 00:48:59,420
Absolutely.
And certainly don't buy your kid

919
00:48:59,420 --> 00:49:01,660
a gun who buys a 16 year old a
gun.

920
00:49:01,700 --> 00:49:03,340
I mean that's just.
I get it.

921
00:49:03,340 --> 00:49:05,180
People are like, oh, we like to
go hunting.

922
00:49:05,180 --> 00:49:08,620
I'm like, well then this should
be a hunting rifle and not a

923
00:49:08,620 --> 00:49:10,580
pistol.
Exactly.

924
00:49:10,700 --> 00:49:12,380
And it's gonna shoot up with
your kid.

925
00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:15,560
Yeah.
And if it's legal, you better

926
00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:19,160
make sure, like, just like you
want to give your kid, you know,

927
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:22,720
a bottle of tequila, right?
You know, don't give him a gun.

928
00:49:22,720 --> 00:49:24,800
You know?
I mean, the laws exist for a

929
00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:25,640
reason.
You're a parent.

930
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:27,520
You got to be responsible.
You got to keep those things

931
00:49:27,520 --> 00:49:30,520
locked up and say.
No, I I definitely agree with

932
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:34,640
you on so much of that.
Well, what I want to say is

933
00:49:34,640 --> 00:49:36,200
first thank you so much for
being here.

934
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:38,400
Is there anything that you
wanted to to talk about?

935
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:41,000
I know you have a book, which
you can definitely.

936
00:49:41,580 --> 00:49:44,860
I do have a book.
Yeah, I thank you.

937
00:49:45,100 --> 00:49:47,460
When I wrote it during the
pandemic, I was actually, I got

938
00:49:47,460 --> 00:49:50,540
to give credits to Nancy Grace.
It was we were talking about.

939
00:49:50,980 --> 00:49:53,380
I forgot what it was another
George Ford or Kyle right now.

940
00:49:53,380 --> 00:49:55,620
It was a commercial.
And she's like, meanwhile you've

941
00:49:55,620 --> 00:49:59,500
done all sorts of crazy things.
You work for the big law firms

942
00:49:59,500 --> 00:50:00,780
and the government and have your
own firm.

943
00:50:00,780 --> 00:50:02,820
You should write a book.
And I'm like, you know what?

944
00:50:02,820 --> 00:50:05,460
I will write a book.
So my book is called Harvard to

945
00:50:05,460 --> 00:50:08,460
Hashtags.
But my journey from being a

946
00:50:08,460 --> 00:50:11,460
Harvard lawyer represents big
companies government and now

947
00:50:11,460 --> 00:50:14,020
just do it every time on social
media right with the tick tocks

948
00:50:14,020 --> 00:50:16,060
with Instagrams.
You can check this out at West

949
00:50:16,060 --> 00:50:18,580
Coast trial Lawyers at Neema
Rahmani.

950
00:50:18,580 --> 00:50:22,540
That's NE AM ARAHMANI.
We always do fun things.

951
00:50:22,540 --> 00:50:24,020
I just shot a couple tick tocks
today.

952
00:50:25,180 --> 00:50:28,780
And the book and the book
Harvard hashtag every dollar

953
00:50:29,220 --> 00:50:31,780
from that book.
All the proceeds go to foster

954
00:50:31,780 --> 00:50:33,260
children at Children's Law
Center.

955
00:50:33,260 --> 00:50:38,270
So it's not a moneymaker.
I think foster kids are some of

956
00:50:38,270 --> 00:50:43,230
the most vulnerable, and they
have such a difficult road ahead

957
00:50:43,230 --> 00:50:45,110
of them, at least here in
California.

958
00:50:45,110 --> 00:50:49,190
And I know this because my
wife's in the system within

959
00:50:49,270 --> 00:50:52,870
three years of turning 18.
Within three years, more than

960
00:50:52,870 --> 00:50:57,540
50% of these foster kids, they
end up homeless, trafficked, in

961
00:50:57,540 --> 00:50:59,900
prison or dead.
Actually, they don't have much

962
00:50:59,900 --> 00:51:01,260
of a chance.
One of my best friends.

963
00:51:01,260 --> 00:51:03,940
He did this for a pretty long
time actually, before he moved

964
00:51:03,940 --> 00:51:05,780
on to getting his masters and
his doctorate.

965
00:51:05,780 --> 00:51:10,700
But his job was specifically to
work with kids who are in aging

966
00:51:10,700 --> 00:51:13,540
out of the foster system, and
they, I think, worked with them

967
00:51:13,540 --> 00:51:16,580
until they were 23.
They were trying to get it

968
00:51:16,580 --> 00:51:20,260
pushed to 24, but essentially
helped them get to college or

969
00:51:20,260 --> 00:51:22,540
wherever they want to go.
Help them learn all the things

970
00:51:22,540 --> 00:51:24,100
that a parent would have taught
you.

971
00:51:24,100 --> 00:51:26,140
I wish there were more
organizations like this.

972
00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:28,840
Across the country because it's
so needed.

973
00:51:30,520 --> 00:51:33,400
It really is.
And it's so sad what these kids

974
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:36,040
go through so like.
Life's hard enough to not have

975
00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:40,000
anybody in your corner, exactly,
without any family support.

976
00:51:40,000 --> 00:51:42,040
And then you're right.
You know a lot of states, you

977
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:43,840
know, again, things are
changing.

978
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:46,040
They're getting, they're getting
better and and they're pushing

979
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:48,280
it out like some.
Some states are even going as

980
00:51:48,280 --> 00:51:52,240
much as 25, but there's others
where it's 18 like you're on

981
00:51:52,240 --> 00:51:53,890
your own.
And what?

982
00:51:53,970 --> 00:51:56,330
I don't know.
I wasn't very responsible at 18.

983
00:51:56,330 --> 00:51:59,570
I don't know about you.
You were heading to Harvard, so

984
00:51:59,570 --> 00:52:01,290
you might have been a little
different from the rest of us.

985
00:52:01,970 --> 00:52:04,370
No, I mean, I had a lot of
support from my parents.

986
00:52:04,370 --> 00:52:07,050
So I mean, my life would have
been completely different if

987
00:52:07,050 --> 00:52:08,810
they wanted. 18 I was a complete
mess.

988
00:52:08,810 --> 00:52:10,330
I don't know if I would be able
to do it by myself.

989
00:52:10,330 --> 00:52:13,570
So definite respect to your wife
for the work that she does

990
00:52:13,570 --> 00:52:16,370
because thank you, it's really
God's work.

991
00:52:16,370 --> 00:52:19,090
So I'm glad that, you know, even
though I went to the private

992
00:52:19,090 --> 00:52:21,980
sector, you know, she was able
to continue doing what she loves

993
00:52:22,140 --> 00:52:24,300
and representing these kids.
Yeah.

994
00:52:24,300 --> 00:52:26,980
Thank you so much for talking to
us tonight.

995
00:52:27,260 --> 00:52:29,460
And I'm definitely gonna keep
looking for you.

996
00:52:29,500 --> 00:52:33,140
I'm sure I'm gonna keep seeing
you on TV now that I have a name

997
00:52:33,180 --> 00:52:37,140
connected that I smoked to you.
Oh, yeah, yeah.

998
00:52:37,140 --> 00:52:39,700
I mean, I do a lot of it.
So I see this guy everywhere.

999
00:52:39,700 --> 00:52:41,380
But yeah, there's ever a legal
case.

1000
00:52:41,580 --> 00:52:43,020
You know me I'm gonna be talking
about.

1001
00:52:43,020 --> 00:52:44,820
I don't care.
It's entertainment, true crime,

1002
00:52:44,820 --> 00:52:46,380
politics.
I'm all about it.

1003
00:52:46,420 --> 00:52:47,620
Or even though in cases we
handle.

1004
00:52:48,380 --> 00:52:50,850
Well.
I think that brings us to the

1005
00:52:50,850 --> 00:52:52,570
end.
Thank you so much for coming to

1006
00:52:52,570 --> 00:52:55,250
speak to us this evening and for
the listeners.

1007
00:52:55,450 --> 00:52:57,490
You all have a good weekend.
Thanks, Brittany.

1008
00:52:57,490 --> 00:52:58,170
Thanks for having me.